Game #533 Tournament game#22 | Round 2 : 2017 PBEM Duel Tournament #22

DarkRider vs  Hiliadan

Match Details

Amount of Humans:2
Kind of Report:2017 PBEM Duel Tournament
Kind of game:   PBEM
Game-value: 45
Result Player Classes Races Team Points Extra Points Missed Points Quitter Rate
1 DarkRiderRogueHumans21100here
2 HiliadanDreadnoughtDwarves1-110-20here
Posts to the game:
Published on Sun, 04 Jun 2017 11:13:35 +0200

Mythical City Upgrade: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia... Lost Cities allow you to build Feathered Serpents with Temple of the Eternal Serpents.

Published on Sun, 04 Jun 2017 08:12:08 +0200

what is MCU?

Published on Sun, 04 Jun 2017 04:52:59 +0200

As I said, "I got the Feathered Serpent (only one) through the MCU from Lost City.". If you're talking about the King Shock Serpent, maybe you could be more explicit. I Ghoul Cursed it with my Necro then evolved it.
And regarding the video, the discussion I linked contained many posts... I was obviously not talking about the 1st one but about the last one where I saw the fight in the Lost City in our game, on turn 8.

Published on Sat, 03 Jun 2017 19:02:27 +0200

I know this multiple or flanking strategy but this video is with some mod and doesn't contain details on how u got the serpent. Did you get serpent as reward or charmed it?

Published on Fri, 02 Jun 2017 16:33:34 +0200

I got the Feathered Serpent (only one) through the MCU from Lost City. Check out here for the fight on turn 8: You're right on time, I had written earlier today I would post the video soon, and I just released it now, while I'm uploading the 3 last turns of my Team Tournament game vs rrrrookie and Jonny Thunder.

Published on Fri, 02 Jun 2017 16:22:34 +0200

I am waiting on how he got the serpents.

Published on Mon, 29 May 2017 21:07:03 +0200

Also I was very impressed in the way he got the Eternal Serpents, but I will let Hiliadan tell himself, it was not bad, and showcase 1 class need further nerf!

Published on Mon, 29 May 2017 19:31:10 +0200

I want to see how you play AI combats. How did you clear those temple sites so early without taking much causality. I never had a chance to see your combats although I was tracking your positions. Can you post  a video of some of your combats against AI especially legendary or mythical sites.

Published on Mon, 29 May 2017 19:16:10 +0200

Yes the easiest way to get a secret spell is the AD sanctum (which usually doesn't contain any tier 4). Even in live game this is game breaking as it could give you can summon spell very early in the game. In live we usually bombard with 6 irregulars or summons before attacking with bigger stack which makes it easier to succeed. Unlucky for me it just gave I guess "Shock missile" or some weak secret spell. We need to fix it and change it to have tier 4 of AD like Horned God like any other sanctums.

I guess I got some units from Farm above and a bandit camp. Also that Necro was dwarf so he had cave crawling and he moved out of there fast into here. Where I grouped him some human units. I remember having cadaver near that cave entrance, maybe we both missed out and you moved north.

Hmm losing 3 fortress really me set back. I need to improve on the scouting. There was even one turn when I lost my leader and only one human swordsman was guarding my throne. If you had saved your drones then it would gg. It was m y longest 1 day wait and thought I would surely lose (given you are good at scouts).

There was one funny moment where you cleared the cave wall for my fire elemental. I guess you wanted to kill it but then saw more army above and thought it was a trap.

Another question. How did you get feathered serpent (16 gold upkeep and not undead) did you build the temple of serpents in one of your city and maybe that was your long time strategy? Is that the reason you casted scorched earth on that last city so that I don't take it and build it against you.

Here is how I decrypted this information.

Gold upkeep means it is not summoned.
Not undead means it is not ghouled
16 base upkeep means it is not converted.
I don't think serpents can be bought from inn or get as reward
So definitely it is build from a city and the fact you have temple sites in ur city.

The only other way you get 16 gold upkeep serpent is "True resurrect". I was so scared that you got "True resurrect" but then I realized there is really no secret spell sites near you or within your reach (unless you have a separate stack roaming on the artic surface).

and the most important question what happened to this serpent as I didn't see it on the final combat.

Published on Mon, 29 May 2017 04:30:46 +0200

Ok thanks for the clarifications. (the Inn near the Sanctum was not cleared when you moved there, I cleared it later, but I guess that the Air Elemental + weak defenders did the trick, it shows we need to check the defender sets in addition to adding new battle enchantments for Forbidden Sanctum)

Regarding your questions:
1. I had only 1 Spy Drone at the beginning, coming from the Cave Entrance where your Lesser Shadow Stalkers killed my hero early game, he had gone out of the Cave before my hero was killed. I moved cautiously with it. At some point, I took a Fortress, and cast a 2nd Spy Drone from there. Then you took it back or I razed it, I don't remember, so I couldn't cast a 2nd Spy Drone from there. Then I moved north and took a 2nd Fortress and cast a 3rd Spy Drone from there. Then I moved back with the 3 Spy Drones toward your throne. I screwed up while moving by clicking too fast and 1 Spy Drone moved through your domain instead of tacking the path outside your domain that I wanted to follow, revealing them, so you killed the 3. I wonder if I could have moved unseen if I had not done this misclick.

2. Pretty simply: I entered the surface from the Cave Entrance in your screenshot, near the Forbidden Sanctum (the Spearman was recruited at the Inn). I was very surprised not to find your Necro hero because I had followed relatively quickly behind him. I spent some turns looking for your Necro in all directions (UG too) but couldn't find it. The Cave Entrance was definitely not guarded and I moved north and west, at some point stumbling on your Fortress.

Published on Sun, 28 May 2017 19:18:49 +0200

From your side I need some clarifications on our scouts.

1. How did you cast so many drones near my throne without leader or hero.

2. Later you took another fortress in the center with a orc martyr (i don't remember exactly), can you explain where that martyr came as I was guarding the entrances

Published on Sun, 28 May 2017 19:14:49 +0200

Hiliadan i am only giving you details out of my courtesy as I don't remember them exactly. Please don't try to use against my own results.

@Marcus and Fist as I told if I had exploited in purpose why would I even share the truth after the game.

All your questions are during early or mid game I only have vague memory of them. Here are the answers.

- how did you get the Lord of the Deep?
   Reward from second lost sanctuary on the surface towards your cave entrance
- how did you manage to get your Eagle Rider to Elite, Blight Elemental to Expert, Fire Elemental to Champion I (or II?), Earth Elemental to Champion I (or more?) on turn 28 while you also had to evolve the Elementals and you did not waste time clearing sites on the surface above the Cave Entrance near my Throne? That's impressive.
   I cleared lot of surface in between my throne and your cave entrance. That has lot of legendary and mythical sites and easy to evolve. Remember I killed your dragons for more exp.  I also had a exp site somewhere in surface. Shadow stalker's evolution comes at the cost of my leader's level. Check my leader's level at the end of game I think he was around 9 in turn 40 which is very low. I have unique talent of managing the exp between my units and leaders to balance out. I am not like you or gab who levels their heroes and leader to lvl 13 in about turn 20. Here is the rough path I took with my sorc stack (Red) and other units (green) that you questioned.

- how did your Necro hero clear a Forbidden Sanctum and then disappeared? where did he move?
That sanctum was really easy it just contains some nymph and shamans. With Necro I already had one entire stack with cadavers and other units. I guess there was also an inn nearby. Remember I can summon the air elemental and moved to the surface through the cave entrance at the end

I managed to take a screenshot from some other turn to illustrate this.

Published on Thu, 25 May 2017 15:42:59 +0200

Update on the match!

The result for the match was contested, me and Fist have discussed it and have agreed that the result will stand, only on the basis that the contested result was brought up too late.

If the result was contested earlier (at the same day or so as the game ended), the verdict would have been a rematch instead.

Darkrider get a strong warning (brings your total up to 2) for exploiting a loophole in the game without properly reporting it, as stated in rule 11. If it comes to our attention you have used an exploit without properly reporting it again, we have no choice then to exclude you from the tournament. 
Hopefully it won't come to that!

Hiliadan also asked you for a few other things from your match, do you mind to reply to the questions?


Published on Sun, 21 May 2017 18:17:31 +0200

Hello there! I finally got time to check the last turn (but that f*cking game got me, I clicked on "Exit" instead of pressing "Esc" so couldn't go back to the map to check some stuff).
Dark, I had a few additional questions:
- how did you get the Lord of the Deep?
- how did you manage to get your Eagle Rider to Elite, Blight Elemental to Expert, Fire Elemental to Champion I (or II?), Earth Elemental to Champion I (or more?) on turn 28 while you also had to evolve the Elementals and you did not waste time clearing sites on the surface above the Cave Entrance near my Throne? That's impressive.
- how did your Necro hero clear a Forbidden Sanctum and then disappeared? where did he move?

I have videos from turn 26 onward, I deleted the previous ones as judges did not request anything about my moves and it indeed takes a lot of space (12 Go for me for turn 26 to 40). I don't think my turn will show you much YOUR errors, rather mine. And I don't really like posting raw videos without comment, I don't think it brings much value-added + nobody watches them. I can post a specific turn/battle if you want but I don't really see the point.

Published on Tue, 09 May 2017 21:59:25 +0200

Here is my first upload.

I don't know why quality is bad YouTube processed it badly. It has only last 8 turns as I didn't have enough space to keep the other. 4+ hours of game play. Although you might be interested in my middle game turns.

Hilidian can you share your video I would like see some of my mistakes.

Published on Tue, 09 May 2017 21:57:39 +0200

As I said I didn't know it was bug or not. I thought that is how it is intended to be used. Before the patch mind controlled units can retreat so I retreated them which is legal.

How would I know if other players are using this or legal or not , no one shares their secret.

Only after reading the patch notes I thought it was exploit/bug but it was fixed already so no use for reporting.

if I had use it again and again I would 2 or 3 stacks of converted elementals  and game would be over in turn 20, but I had only 3 units because first time was accidental and two other times I was trying to find how it actually worked.  Remember Air elemental is summoned from spell.

If Hilidian remember there was blight elemental in one of his left out city fortress which I didn't convert because I realized it is not fair so I didn't use further. Before I could report it was already fixed.

I think I miscommunicated I had true resurrect in another game (lot of games in my list) so I was confused sorry about that.

Published on Mon, 08 May 2017 22:11:21 +0200

Hehe, that is not what you told me and Fist in the email! You said you used True Resurrect, which is a fair use of the spell. To use Arcane Binding and run away with the Elementals is an exploit that should have been reported!

See rule 11 of the tournament:
"11. Players should not voluntarily exploits bug or weaknesses in the game. Players should report any bug or exploit to judges or on the official forum when they discover them. Judges can decide to ban players using exploits from the tournament."

I'm not saying you will be banned, but this is a clear example of something that need to be reported and not use it again, and again!

Published on Mon, 08 May 2017 19:32:32 +0200

Here it is as the game over and it is no longer useful I will reveal it.

I was in combat with my Sorcerer who has arcane binding. I know arcane binding doesn't permanently mind control the units like other mind control abilities. But I use it for winning the tactical combats easily. During this combat I arcane bound a lesser fire elemental whom I accidentally retreated while trying to move. I thought the unit would be dead at the end of combat but it was permanently mind controlled. I was not sure whether it was temporary bug so when I had a chance I tried again for a lesser earth and lesser blight elemental and it seemed worked. I evolved them to regular. I wasn't able to use it much because I was chasing hilidian and doesn't have a chance for any other elementals. After the game update to Poseidon the mind controlled units cannot retreat thereby making it useless.

For Air elemental I have summon spell when I upload my video you will see it. For Shadow stalkers I built them by rushing and around 4 of them I evolved them from scoundrels.

I did lot of mistakes in this game, 2 major mistake where my whole leader stack was dead in a mythical and another stack died in legendary. I need to improve my game play in auto in these deadly sites.

Regarding Hilidian he was using the necromantic aura I think this needs to be nerfed.

Published on Mon, 08 May 2017 18:25:26 +0200

533 | Age of Wonders 3

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

Congratulations DarkRider!

I hope you also made some videos that can be uploaded and shared to the community.

Now you can also reveal the "secret" to how you was able to get so many different elementals, without having any elemental-mastery!


Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

At turn 40 the game finally ended.

Final Combat Preparation

Final Combat Result


Interesting game overall, although last 10 turns is hunt down for the fight towards edge of the map.

GG Hiliadan. Good luck to rest of the tournament.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

Completed my turn, you can put back the timer on.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

Can you remove the timer till the issue is resolved in beta branch?

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

Not able to play my turn after the game update. Same error as everyone is getting. I think Triumph will say the old games are not compatible with new update in which case we will need the old version.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

For some I have spell to summon them for other I have sent info to the judges.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100


Me and Fist have agreed Hiliadan receives a warning (with proof) for his crash which results in a restart.

Hiliadan will also need to disband the unit which died in the battle before the crash, if it would survive.

You can continue the game!


Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

Just got a crash on a tactical fight. I was running in debug mode so I have a log and I also have a video of the crash. Sent everything to the judges, waiting for their feedback.

While we wait... could you please confirm (to judges if strategic info) that you got your 3 Elementals from the Summon spells from sites?
It would be good to use our game as an example to show it is necessary to beef up the defense of some sites, to avoid situations where you have very strong T3/T4 summons on turn 20-30.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

No that happened before I start recording, It is forbidden sanctum @Marcus I have screenshot of that site if you want I can PM.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

I also heard in one of the live game conversation that hailstorm which is totally useless spell is replaced by great hail. But not sure whether it was done in a specific mod (like MP mod that we use for live) or in the base game . I would suggest check the list again from inside the game.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

If you still have the video of your turn, you can even upload it after games end!

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

If you complete your turn, I can take the screenshot of that site and send to judges or wait till end of the game.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

Ok, you remember which Legendary site so that we can check how it ended up here? Because in theory, Forbidden Sanctum and other Legendary sites giving spells give only Secret spells and it's not in the list. As we're going to balance Secret spells at some point, it would be good to know if the list is incomplete...

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

I even got this spell from legendary reward site in one of recent live game. It is pretty good at live game where you can surprise an AOE attack for 20 cp. But it is not much useful in the PBEM I haven't used until in the recent autos which was lucky and crippled you.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

I got it from a legendary reward site.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

Yes it was Great Hail and it cost 20 CP. (x2 because leader not there)

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

There is 2 spells, which have the identical result, with the small difference of lasting either 1 turn or whole battle:
Hailstorm (secret spell) last the whole battle and
Great Hail (Water spell) last only one turn.

Are you sure it was just one turn?

Edit: I see now that Hailstorm is also random, while you can choose the area for Great Hail.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

Hi DarkRider! Could you please explain how you got Great Hail? It's a Water Master T5 and you are playing Fire Adept and Destruction Master and it's not a secret spell. You can send the explanation only to judges if it's strategic info I should not know.


Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

I completed my turn and recorded it . Hiliadan can you put back the timer on.

Published on Thu, 01 Jan 1970 01:00:00 +0100

I can understand totally. I really don't want anyone to be uncomfortable. If I made a mistake I apologize.